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sjlovestosing
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December 12, 2019 9:43 am  

Hi Liza, 

If you ever come here, you are most welcome to stay here with my husband and I in the Northeast Kingdom. We are 1 1/2 hours from Burlington, where UVM is located. So it's a doable commute. (I should know!)

Stella


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VeganOstomy
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December 12, 2019 12:29 pm  
Posted by: @squeakyandliza

Mike, do you know if tegaderm is the same as duoderm?

Very different. Tegaderm is a very thin film while duoderm is more like an artificial skin, but thicker than tegaderm. Duoderm usually goes under the wafer, while tegaderm is often used over an appliance. Tegaderm can be used under the wafer, but it has no absorptive properties, so it's not really designed to be used like that. 

Just your friendly neighborhood ostomate.

~ Crohn's Disease ¦ Ileostomy ~


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SqueakyandLiza
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December 12, 2019 2:06 pm  

Thanks Stella!!  That is so sweet of you!!

Thanks Eric!!  I will definitely try using the Duoderm under my wafer now that I know I can use it that way.  That should at least help with the raw skin from the wafer.  I'm not sure if I can get it close enough to the stoma to help with the really red skin from the leaking issues. It is exciting to have a whole new thing to try.

I remember my home nurse talking about Tegaderm, but now I wonder if it was the drape that came with the wound vacuum pump kits for when she did the changes.  If so, that is what I have been using to secure my wafer, and my skin seems to have problems with it.

-Liza
“May your day be bright and your bag be light.”


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VeganOstomy
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December 12, 2019 10:21 pm  
Posted by: @squeakyandliza

I remember my home nurse talking about Tegaderm, but now I wonder if it was the drape that came with the wound vacuum pump kits for when she did the changes. 

Yes! It would be used for that purpose for sure.

Just your friendly neighborhood ostomate.

~ Crohn's Disease ¦ Ileostomy ~


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SqueakyandLiza
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December 14, 2019 4:58 am  

I changed my appliance earlier this evening and put a little duoderm on the broken skin just under the wafer and a little strip under the wafer along the side toward my wound, where all the leaks are. Then after just about 3 hours I got a leak. I just finished replacing it AGAIN. Ugh. I did the same thing with the duoderm. Hopefully this time it will last long enough to see if it helps. 🤞

I think maybe this leak was due to the paste??  I was using the stomadhesive paste the ostomy nurse used and then gave me the rest of the tube. I am used to the brava paste, so that is what I used just now. The other problem might have been some pancaking. With an ileostomy, I usually don’t have super think output, but for some reason tonight I do. And since my stoma is recessed and opens to the side, it is pretty easy for it to creep under the wafer. 😕

-Liza
“May your day be bright and your bag be light.”


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LK
 LK
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December 14, 2019 5:52 am  

Liza, my goodness lady. So much work for such a short time. I hope things improve quickly for you and seeing a new GI may be  your answer. I'm still puzzled over this doctor making your life difficult for him to have a  easier time  reversing it! A bit like wam, bam, thank you ma'am, my pockets  are full and so is the pouch companies now! I apologize if that was too crude for anyone, but it is a reality.  I would certainly  strongly clarify with the new GI guy how you want a say in  your stoma formation next  round and hold him to it! 

May I suggest that before you do an actual trial run of a new bag on your already irritated  skin,  you try  it out  in another area on your tummy so you do not unintentionally upset the apple cart any further then  where the original already is with angry skin. Just thinking....

Linda


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VeganOstomy
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December 16, 2019 11:21 am  

@squeakyandliza

Generally speaking (although, I find this to be true nearly all the time), the more layers you add in the form of additional products, the more of a chance you'll have failures. 

I don't use paste at all - ever. But it does have its uses, mostly to fill gaps in the skin. It's not to be used as an adhesive, despite the misleading name "Stomahesive".  If you aren't trying to fill in any gaps, skip it. 

The duoderm, just like your wafer, won't stick if your skin is weepy. When that happens, I really do try to let my skin air out and I'll even use stoma powder on the exposed skin to help get it dry. Then I wipe it off before I continue with the rest of my appliance change. Again, I'll leave my skin open to the air for hours at a time when a problem like this happens. 

Just your friendly neighborhood ostomate.

~ Crohn's Disease ¦ Ileostomy ~


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SqueakyandLiza
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December 16, 2019 11:36 am  
Posted by: @veganostomy
 
If you aren't trying to fill in any gaps, skip it. 

 

Oh boy, do I have gaps!  I definitely need the paste. Between the original incision and then the surgeon reopening my wound to clean it out in hopes that it would heal, I have weird creases and lots of hard scar tissue on my tummy. It is definitely far from being a nice flat surface. Haha. 

I sure appreciate all your advice and information, Eric. The skin is often a little weepy. The duoderm didn’t seem to make any difference, so I skipped it the last change, and used Marathon instead.   I do like the idea of going a while without the wafer. As long as I can time it to where Squeaky will behave, rather than changing in response to a leak. 

I sort of feel like I’m hanging on by a thread here, so even just getting my skin a little better would help with my outlook. 😀

-Liza
“May your day be bright and your bag be light.”


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VeganOstomy
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December 16, 2019 11:46 am  
Posted by: @squeakyandliza

I sort of feel like I’m hanging on by a thread here, so even just getting my skin a little better would help with my outlook.

I can certainly understand you there! 

I'm sorry if I missed it somewhere, but have you tried a barrier ring on that damaged skin? I tend to have very good results using pretty much any barrier ring when my skin needs to heal. It's not a guaranteed solution if the skin is weepy, but I find that it offers a much more gentle covering for damaged skin vs. traditional adhesive coverings.

Posted by: @squeakyandliza

 I definitely need the paste.

Do you think the paste may be contributing to the irritated skin? Have you tried more than one brand? Are you using alcohol-free paste?

Just your friendly neighborhood ostomate.

~ Crohn's Disease ¦ Ileostomy ~


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dogtalkerer
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December 16, 2019 5:29 pm  

it sounds like you need to keep more inward pressure on the concave flange very near the stoma,   so the stoma can not retract behind flange and get output behind the concavity.  this is where the stoma pro anti pancake device might help out.  with a weight belt or something similar , you could snuggly wrap the bag tight against your body, putting inward pressure on the stoma pro dome that transfers pressure to the concave flange close to the stoma where pressure appears to be needed..   then stoma pro dome would allow output to flow into the bag.    the duoderm might then work better sandwiched against your body with  pressure holding it in place.   trial and error would be the trick to getting this working.

on its own, duoderm doesn't sound like it has the adhesiveness to be under a flange.


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SqueakyandLiza
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December 16, 2019 5:55 pm  
Posted by: @dogtalkerer

it sounds like you need to keep more inward pressure on the concave flange very near the stoma,   so the stoma can not retract behind flange and get output behind the concavity.  this is where the stoma pro anti pancake device might help out.  with a weight belt or something similar , you could snuggly wrap the bag tight against your body, putting inward pressure on the stoma pro dome that transfers pressure to the concave flange close to the stoma where pressure appears to be needed..   then stoma pro dome would allow output to flow into the bag.  

That is exactly what I need, something to keep the wafer pushed in.  When I am applying it, if I can push the wafer in, my stoma will stick through it, but the adhesive alone does not provide enough pressure to keep the stoma sticking through the wafer.  I'm a little concerned, because I already feel like the convex wafer is bruising me a little bit, and having something else constantly pushing it into my tummy might make that worse, but given a choice between the leaks, and a big circular bruise on my tummy, I would take the bruise.  I will definitely look into this option.  Thanks.

-Liza
“May your day be bright and your bag be light.”


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SqueakyandLiza
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December 16, 2019 6:07 pm  
Posted by: @veganostomy

 

I'm sorry if I missed it somewhere, but have you tried a barrier ring on that damaged skin? I tend to have very good results using pretty much any barrier ring when my skin needs to heal. It's not a guaranteed solution if the skin is weepy, but I find that it offers a much more gentle covering for damaged skin vs. traditional adhesive coverings.

 

I have tried the barrier rings.  Both the ostomy nurse and the home nurse that was coming while I had the wound pump both tried them, and I had leaks almost instantly.  They just did not contour to the bumps and creases in my skin the way the paste does.

Do you think the paste may be contributing to the irritated skin? Have you tried more than one brand? Are you using alcohol-free paste?

I don't think the paste is hurting.  The only paste I use now is the brava paste by coloplast, because it doesn't have any alcohol and with my skin being so broken down, the stomadhesive with alcohol burns too badly.  And the Eakin paste doesn't hold up well for me.  And actually, I think the paste might be working in two ways.  One, of course, it is preventing the leaks by filling in the bumps in my skin.  But I think it is also protecting my skin from the output that inevitably works its way through.  The reason I think that is I tried a couple times just putting paste on the side of my stoma toward the wound, because that is where 90% of my leaks are.  When I removed that appliance, my skin was beet red everywhere except where the paste had been and since I can never completely keep output from getting under the wafer, I think the paste is providing some protection to my skin.  The output breaks down the paste, but until it does, it might actually be helping.

Thanks Eric!!

-Liza
“May your day be bright and your bag be light.”


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Tony
 Tony
(@ileostony)
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December 16, 2019 6:28 pm  

Hi Liza,

 

Have you tried this yet?

 

SAMPLE: Silken Silicone Stoma Gel 8g Tube

Tony
Crohn's diagnosed in 1995.
Spontaneous colon perforation and emergency end ileostomy surgery in 2018.
No colon - still rollin'!
No eyesight - life still bright!
Stomaversary - December 4th


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SqueakyandLiza
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December 16, 2019 7:26 pm  

@ileostony

Tony--I have never even heard of it, but I will certainly give it a try.  It seems like it would be easier to apply than the paste is too.  Thanks!!  You are awesome!!

Edit:  I just ordered a sample.  :)

-Liza
“May your day be bright and your bag be light.”


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Tony
 Tony
(@ileostony)
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Posts: 215
December 16, 2019 7:52 pm  

This company has a few other products that look promising for skin protection. I just found them as a recommendation for a Twitter follow, of all things . If I needed to try something new I would try their products.

Tony
Crohn's diagnosed in 1995.
Spontaneous colon perforation and emergency end ileostomy surgery in 2018.
No colon - still rollin'!
No eyesight - life still bright!
Stomaversary - December 4th


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