@veganostomy Hey it's me again. Well after several failures since this thread started I am now seriously getting back on the track of finding a better product. I don't understand why a company this large doesn't take these complaints seriously. The customer service person is awesome, but I think all they are empowered to do is issue replacement products and log the incident. She said to me last time that with my video and photo evidence that the product team(s) would be digging into the problem. That was 4 months ago. Anyway my stop-gap measures of micropore taping the usual leakage areas along with the large IKEA bag clip and some Bounty paper towel and using a pouch cover have made these 4 months at least more predictable. I have even had 6-7 day cycles which is also why I have kept going this way. Well, sure as s**t, I do a swap 2 days ago and didn't bother because it was a new box and figured what are the odds etc. The thing started leaking without my knowledge while watching TV and lets just say it was an unholy embarrassing mess which got my anger level up! After cleaning up I was fortunate to have a quiet stoma and got it switched out with no issues. Less than 24 hours later the pouch started to leak out of the opposite side but the same general area around the closure. Needless to say I have passed along the lot # and my regrets to the Hollister rep that I don't think that I can have any trust in them if they can't explain to me why these pouches are so poorly manufactured. It has to be them cutting back on plastic usage to save money. The pouch that I really liked that they discontinued was at least .5 or double the mil thickness which is why they lasted longer and didn't leak! I doubt that they would ever admit that but I think that is exactly why no follow up.

Sorry for the rant but I thought things had settled down but now I am going to look at some of the other manufacturers and suggestions here. I may have to go back to a 2 piece system and call it a day.

Cheers!

Dan

@jdanh ... Yes, I think those of us that have been dealing with leaks are all pretty much fed up beyond measure with leaks & Hollister.  My last complaint to Hollister was about leaks & them being unable to admit dishonesty due to their lousy product  choices & or availability due to covid & or possibly even new management.  I think the founder of Hollister would be shocked to learn of these iòssues. 

My best results are using electrical tape but  on my present pouch,  I'm using "waterproof electrical tape".  I'm VERY PLEASED with THE W.Poof E. TAPE. . I start taping by removing about an inch of fabric from behind the pouch to allow tape to stick better, I make a quick wipe with rubbing alcohol & then place  tape down the sides & fold the tape around the sides to the back, secure it. Then I tape starting from the opened, lower end of the hard plastic, place tape at the 1/2 way of Hard Plastic making sure to cover the areas & tape over where the folds happen bcuz leaks have come thru there as well. So, each hard plastic (HP),  has tapes starting at the bottom & placed 1/2 way the last HP & work my way up to the top, holding area. I even cover the top HP to make up the difference of plastic thickness of elec. tape & pouch plastic thickness.  On the back, I add the tape the single HP ,  1/2 way the width of HP & right onto the soft plastic. Then bcuz I'm dealing with arthritis & sore fingers,  I make like a T with at the center fold of a strip of tape, 1/2 width & add that at the top of HP  near the opening to make a pull tab to open the pouch with. Once the top velcro flap is rolled closed, I add tape across that 1/2 on the flap, 1/2 on the soft plastic to give more strength & cover an area where the plastic is weak & has also torn on the corners as well. 

I hope the placement of tape description makes sense! I've only once had an issue with the velcro closure opening on me & it was bcuz I had not pressed the velcro pieces together hard enough to actually shut causing the velcro to hook on my pants & then it came open & made a mess! Hollister changed the Velcro as well, lol,  although I can't see them ever admitting to that too !!!!  I hope this helps you some way! 

Linda

Posted by: @jdanh

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Sorry for the rant but I thought things had settled down but now I am going to look at some of the other manufacturers and suggestions here. I may have to go back to a 2 piece system and call it a day.

Don't discount trying some really inexpensive bags off Amazon. For years, I was reluctant to even entertain the idea that a $2 bag would work better than a $10 bag.

Over the last month, the brand I've been using (Heagimed, and they have a bunch of styles) has been working better than both Hollister and Coloplast bags that I sampled before switching. I have another brand coming, which honestly look like they could all be from the same factory, but the closure style looks more like Coloplast's.

But, these aren't perfect by any stretch.

The outlet is frustrating, and sometimes I'll get moisture there. I do have the same bags with clips, so I'll try those at some point. These also stick REALLY WELL, so much that an adhesive remover is necessary just to clean off the skin. By that token, it also leaves a lot of coloured fluff around the edges (from clothing caught in the adhesive), so it's not as "clean" as the other brands.

My skin, however, has never looked better. I went from constant battling with skin issues since last summer, to having skin so healthy that it looks like I only just had my surgery. Incredible results. 

At this point, my only real worry is whether these will be available for the foreseeable future. No-name brands come and go, and it would be a shame to lose this one, which is one reason why I'm trying a few brands.

I will note that I have a routine to help ensure that the wafer is stuck as well as it can be, including:

• Warming the wafer in my hands before applying it.
• Taking a small cap or empty roll of toilet paper and using it to apply pressure around my stoma for about a minute.
• Holding the wafer in place with my hand for at least a minute.
• Sometimes, using the Nu-Comfort belt so apply added pressure around the wafer for a few hours (totally optional, but I think it helps).

One last thing. The bags I'm using have filters, but the filter needs holes poked in it to work. So, the use of the filter is optional, which I love. If they had open filters out of the box, I might not be so quick to recommend them.

@dlkfiretruck Thanks for the detailed DIY process! Isn't it amazing what people can do when faced with this sort of adversity? At this point I think I will, by default, tape these pouches up for the remaining stock I have and will try to sample as many equivalent products as I can. I can't think of an appropriate analogy off the top of my head buy this whole thing we are doing is just wrong. Customers who have no alternatives should not be put in a position where WE are doing workarounds because of their own defective products. They must have a very high acceptable failure threshold given the lack of any appropriate management level response. They just tell the lower level staff to apologize and give them free product replacements. I don't even know if anyone has ever seen what those numbers look like! Anyway thanks for your reply and information!

@veganostomy Thanks so much for jumping back into this topic. The funny thing about this whole affair is I have had ZERO problems around my stoma. I switched to the one-piece mainly because I had so many skin issues, blowouts etc - plus a slight reduction on the costs (which are mostly out of pocket here in BC with no insurance). I am assuming that these other products on Amazon would not qualify for medical receipts(?) I seem to remember trying the Mio pouch some time ago and that closure was way too much fussing to get it fully secure. I think that that design is still in place. This morning I finally got rid of this last pouch when I was thinking that next time I might just cut that whole section off and use those clips they use for pouches without closure systems. Part of the issue for my DIY tape solution is not covering the velcro portion, which ironically is ALWAYS in that same general area. I think this is why it's best done before using the product, but I am at a point I'm not going to continue dealing with an issue that should be fixed by those who make it. I will say that I also think my skin is in much better shape since I started to use the Medline no-sting adhesive wipes. They have to be the fastest-acting "stickiest" product I have ever used. For me I started using these because of many accidents in the middle of applying the pouch and honestly I have never once got in trouble with even 15 seconds of cool blow dryer. Anyway this part of my process has been pretty good for about 8 months now until I started to use these one piece products. With a pouch failure like this, I often said to myself that if it was a 2 piece system you just switch the pouch and Bob's 'yer Uncle....:)  I'm not quite ready to go back there yet. Thanks again! Dan

@veganostomy I forgot to mention that I have to use convex pouches which does limit the range of options I have though I see that this Heagimed company does have them but cut-to-fit, something I am admittedly incompetent in consistently cutting the correct opening (which led to many many blowouts early in my experience).

@jdanh I no longer have private insurance, but the way they did things was that as long as the product was purchased within Canada, I could send a receipt. But with the Ontario grants we get, I just use that to buy whatever I need, wherever it ships from!

Yes, I saw that Heagimed has convex. If you're able to get them covered, I say go for it!

Interestingly enough, many months ago someone who commented on my YouTube video said that they were using some Amazon bags, and it was a life-changer for them. Worked better than anything else. I was skeptical, but I'm glad I finally tried them! Not sure what brand they went with, though.

@veganostomy Oh dang that is too bad about the Amazon bags. It's funny I just checked out their Amazon store and a bunch of their products use the old clips. Sometimes I wonder if those things do the job then why all the fuss about velcro and z-lock or whatever corporate name they give to the `feature' they have. I am not sure about BC; I know that they don't cover anything if you have a household income of (can't recall the threshold), and then once you spend over that they cover 80%.  Anyway I am bent on finding something that I can trust and not have all this stress around failures and struggling to find bandaid solutions.

Posted by: @jdanh

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It's funny I just checked out their Amazon store and a bunch of their products use the old clips. Sometimes I wonder if those things do the job then why all the fuss about velcro and z-lock or whatever corporate name they give to the `feature' they have.

Yes, I have a few of these Amazon bags with the clips, which I haven't used yet. You can find clips from various brands that are more robust than the cheap ones you get with these bags, so I'm sure they can be pretty reliable.

My only concern with using clips is that there's no rigidity at the outlet, so emptying and cleaning isn't as convenient.

That said, I received some from the brand "Deraymi" and their filters are exposed out of the box, which is a shame, but hopefully they don't leak 😥 

Hi 👋, On the clip topic, I have never used a bag with Velcro simply because the first product I used had a clip. In all the time with an ostomy have never had one break and never had one open. Only fail was one slipped off but that was due to a heavy tug!! And I have to maybe count the time I didn’t put it on in the first place 🥴

@veganostomy My thoughts about the clip are they can be way more reliable in terms of stopping output flow, but in one case I had used a clip it felt like it was pinching the plastic too much which I thought could also lead to damage and then more leaks... I know I was at a point a while ago where I just wanted to snip off that entire closure and DIY a better (if not very elegant looking) solution that I felt more comfortable with.

@john68 Glad to hear that you have had better outcomes with your pouch closure!

@john68 If that's the case, I may try the clipped bags on my next appliance change! Do you have a box of extra clips saved up? I would imagine if they don't break, you probably have a ton of spares! 🤣

I probably could supply all the members of VO for a very long time. I can’t bear to throw them out so I do have a drawer full 😁 . Only thing I can say is any one who uses lube in the bag just make sure the end is well wiped 👍

@veganostomy  I have to tell you that I got a reply from Hollister (and Coloplast too are eager to talk to me) first trying to educate me about the large corporation they are and things `take time' to investigate.

Coming from an IT Management background every company of this size will have a computer application that captures all the incoming complaints, generates incident/trouble tickets and ongoing updates are provide by the techs involved. In the back of this is a large database that managment can run reports on - say by SKU number and probably LOT# along with keywords in the problem description like "leak". They are more than big enough to have a system like that but they are private and I don't think they want to tell customers this sort of important info. It's all about legal liability if you ask me...and that doesn't help anyone except them.

@jdanh Just a quick update regarding the Amazon bags (both brands):

The one that's supposed to have a closed filter (i.e. instructions say to poke holes if you need to), actually does have very small slits in it.

How do I know this? Because I had a leak through the filter. Not enough to be messy, but enough to notice. I guess I'll be taping those... or maybe dropping crazy glue in the filter before putting it on. haha!

Yeah, I don't know how these companies handle complaints or problems, but I'm sure they miss a lot (or don't share that there are waves of issues).

Try paper medical tape after squeezing the Velcro together and then folding the spout up into the cheap fabric.

the paper tape holds great all day one piece.  I replace with a new 2-3 inch daily , and it releases from the fabric and can be reused all day.